First and foremost, the real yields for Treasuries, at least at the short end, have become negative; it seems highly unlikely that inflation over the next two years, any way you calculate it, is going to be less than the 1.99% yield of the two-year note. (Historical comment: During the Great Depression, because of a quirk in the math, T-bills briefly produced a tiny negative return. However, this occurred during a time of general deflation and thus still resulted in positive real returns.)
This is confirmed by the latest TIPS curve. Notice the negative real yield below five years:
Meanwhile, the junk-Treasury spread, depending on how you measure it, is now north of 700 basis points. If we assume that mid-rated junk has a loss rate of 4% per year and a maturity of 10 years, then its expected real return is the +1% TIPS yield at that point on the curve plus the 7% spread minus the 4% loss rate, or 4%. Compounding things even further, because of forced sales by hedge funds, the yields on municipal bonds are now several dozen basis points above that of Treasuries, something that occurs perhaps once in a generation, and usually at times of local government distress, which does not seem in the cards at the moment.
To complete the picture, stocks, if we are lucky, are still priced for a long-term real return of about 3.5 percent. (The dividend yield of the S&P 500 is currently 2.37%, to which another optimistic percent of real per-share growth can be added.)
Conclusion: The debt markets are so out of whack that we are now at a point where credit risk is being rewarded more than equity risk, something that should never happen in a world where equity investors own only the residual rights to earnings. This cannot last for very long: either spreads will tighten rapidly, equity prices will fall rapidly, or both. (Or, chortle, earnings will grow more rapidly.) Stay tuned.
Pessimism of the Intellect, Optimism of the Will Favorite posts | Manifold podcast | Twitter: @hsu_steve
Thursday, August 07, 2008
Strange days
William Bernstein at Efficient Frontier noted back in March that dysfunctional credit markets are exhibiting historically anomalous yield spreads. Aversion to credit risk is at almost irrational levels. Spreads are only rational if you think everything else can / will crash leaving only the US government solvent to repay its debts.
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
Blog Archive
-
▼
2008
(254)
-
▼
08
(16)
- Obama 08
- A warning from von Neumann
- ECT in Trento
- Dense nuclear matter: intuition fails!
- Dense nuclear matter
- The cost of gold
- Bolt is the greatest of all time
- Phelps, shmelps -- Bolt is the man
- Scifoo 2008 photos
- Scifoo 2008
- Strange days
- The tidal wave from PRC
- Judo in the WEC
- LA Times: no bottom yet for housing
- Angry Youth: Chinese nationalism
- How Alpha becomes Beta
-
▼
08
(16)
Labels
- physics (420)
- genetics (325)
- globalization (301)
- genomics (295)
- technology (282)
- brainpower (280)
- finance (275)
- american society (261)
- China (249)
- innovation (231)
- ai (206)
- economics (202)
- psychometrics (190)
- science (172)
- psychology (169)
- machine learning (166)
- biology (163)
- photos (162)
- genetic engineering (150)
- universities (150)
- travel (144)
- podcasts (143)
- higher education (141)
- startups (139)
- human capital (127)
- geopolitics (124)
- credit crisis (115)
- political correctness (108)
- iq (107)
- quantum mechanics (107)
- cognitive science (103)
- autobiographical (97)
- politics (93)
- careers (90)
- bounded rationality (88)
- social science (86)
- history of science (85)
- realpolitik (85)
- statistics (83)
- elitism (81)
- talks (80)
- evolution (79)
- credit crunch (78)
- biotech (76)
- genius (76)
- gilded age (73)
- income inequality (73)
- caltech (68)
- books (64)
- academia (62)
- history (61)
- intellectual history (61)
- MSU (60)
- sci fi (60)
- harvard (58)
- silicon valley (58)
- mma (57)
- mathematics (55)
- education (53)
- video (52)
- kids (51)
- bgi (48)
- black holes (48)
- cdo (45)
- derivatives (43)
- neuroscience (43)
- affirmative action (42)
- behavioral economics (42)
- economic history (42)
- literature (42)
- nuclear weapons (42)
- computing (41)
- jiujitsu (41)
- physical training (40)
- film (39)
- many worlds (39)
- quantum field theory (39)
- expert prediction (37)
- ufc (37)
- bjj (36)
- bubbles (36)
- mortgages (36)
- google (35)
- race relations (35)
- hedge funds (34)
- security (34)
- von Neumann (34)
- meritocracy (31)
- feynman (30)
- quants (30)
- taiwan (30)
- efficient markets (29)
- foo camp (29)
- movies (29)
- sports (29)
- music (28)
- singularity (27)
- entrepreneurs (26)
- conferences (25)
- housing (25)
- obama (25)
- subprime (25)
- venture capital (25)
- berkeley (24)
- epidemics (24)
- war (24)
- wall street (23)
- athletics (22)
- russia (22)
- ultimate fighting (22)
- cds (20)
- internet (20)
- new yorker (20)
- blogging (19)
- japan (19)
- scifoo (19)
- christmas (18)
- dna (18)
- gender (18)
- goldman sachs (18)
- university of oregon (18)
- cold war (17)
- cryptography (17)
- freeman dyson (17)
- smpy (17)
- treasury bailout (17)
- algorithms (16)
- autism (16)
- personality (16)
- privacy (16)
- Fermi problems (15)
- cosmology (15)
- happiness (15)
- height (15)
- india (15)
- oppenheimer (15)
- probability (15)
- social networks (15)
- wwii (15)
- fitness (14)
- government (14)
- les grandes ecoles (14)
- neanderthals (14)
- quantum computers (14)
- blade runner (13)
- chess (13)
- hedonic treadmill (13)
- nsa (13)
- philosophy of mind (13)
- research (13)
- aspergers (12)
- climate change (12)
- harvard society of fellows (12)
- malcolm gladwell (12)
- net worth (12)
- nobel prize (12)
- pseudoscience (12)
- Einstein (11)
- art (11)
- democracy (11)
- entropy (11)
- geeks (11)
- string theory (11)
- television (11)
- Go (10)
- ability (10)
- complexity (10)
- dating (10)
- energy (10)
- football (10)
- france (10)
- italy (10)
- mutants (10)
- nerds (10)
- olympics (10)
- pop culture (10)
- crossfit (9)
- encryption (9)
- eugene (9)
- flynn effect (9)
- james salter (9)
- simulation (9)
- tail risk (9)
- turing test (9)
- alan turing (8)
- alpha (8)
- ashkenazim (8)
- data mining (8)
- determinism (8)
- environmentalism (8)
- games (8)
- keynes (8)
- manhattan (8)
- new york times (8)
- pca (8)
- philip k. dick (8)
- qcd (8)
- real estate (8)
- robot genius (8)
- success (8)
- usain bolt (8)
- Iran (7)
- aig (7)
- basketball (7)
- free will (7)
- fx (7)
- game theory (7)
- hugh everett (7)
- inequality (7)
- information theory (7)
- iraq war (7)
- markets (7)
- paris (7)
- patents (7)
- poker (7)
- teaching (7)
- vietnam war (7)
- volatility (7)
- anthropic principle (6)
- bayes (6)
- class (6)
- drones (6)
- econtalk (6)
- empire (6)
- global warming (6)
- godel (6)
- intellectual property (6)
- nassim taleb (6)
- noam chomsky (6)
- prostitution (6)
- rationality (6)
- academia sinica (5)
- bobby fischer (5)
- demographics (5)
- fake alpha (5)
- kasparov (5)
- luck (5)
- nonlinearity (5)
- perimeter institute (5)
- renaissance technologies (5)
- sad but true (5)
- software development (5)
- solar energy (5)
- warren buffet (5)
- 100m (4)
- Poincare (4)
- assortative mating (4)
- bill gates (4)
- borges (4)
- cambridge uk (4)
- censorship (4)
- charles darwin (4)
- computers (4)
- creativity (4)
- hormones (4)
- humor (4)
- judo (4)
- kerviel (4)
- microsoft (4)
- mixed martial arts (4)
- monsters (4)
- moore's law (4)
- soros (4)
- supercomputers (4)
- trento (4)
- 200m (3)
- babies (3)
- brain drain (3)
- charlie munger (3)
- cheng ting hsu (3)
- chet baker (3)
- correlation (3)
- ecosystems (3)
- equity risk premium (3)
- facebook (3)
- fannie (3)
- feminism (3)
- fst (3)
- intellectual ventures (3)
- jim simons (3)
- language (3)
- lee kwan yew (3)
- lewontin fallacy (3)
- lhc (3)
- magic (3)
- michael lewis (3)
- mit (3)
- nathan myhrvold (3)
- neal stephenson (3)
- olympiads (3)
- path integrals (3)
- risk preference (3)
- search (3)
- sec (3)
- sivs (3)
- society generale (3)
- systemic risk (3)
- thailand (3)
- twitter (3)
- alibaba (2)
- bear stearns (2)
- bruce springsteen (2)
- charles babbage (2)
- cloning (2)
- david mamet (2)
- digital books (2)
- donald mackenzie (2)
- drugs (2)
- dune (2)
- exchange rates (2)
- frauds (2)
- freddie (2)
- gaussian copula (2)
- heinlein (2)
- industrial revolution (2)
- james watson (2)
- ltcm (2)
- mating (2)
- mba (2)
- mccain (2)
- monkeys (2)
- national character (2)
- nicholas metropolis (2)
- no holds barred (2)
- offices (2)
- oligarchs (2)
- palin (2)
- population structure (2)
- prisoner's dilemma (2)
- singapore (2)
- skidelsky (2)
- socgen (2)
- sprints (2)
- star wars (2)
- ussr (2)
- variance (2)
- virtual reality (2)
- war nerd (2)
- abx (1)
- anathem (1)
- andrew lo (1)
- antikythera mechanism (1)
- athens (1)
- atlas shrugged (1)
- ayn rand (1)
- bay area (1)
- beats (1)
- book search (1)
- bunnie huang (1)
- car dealers (1)
- carlos slim (1)
- catastrophe bonds (1)
- cdos (1)
- ces 2008 (1)
- chance (1)
- children (1)
- cochran-harpending (1)
- cpi (1)
- david x. li (1)
- dick cavett (1)
- dolomites (1)
- eharmony (1)
- eliot spitzer (1)
- escorts (1)
- faces (1)
- fads (1)
- favorite posts (1)
- fiber optic cable (1)
- francis crick (1)
- gary brecher (1)
- gizmos (1)
- greece (1)
- greenspan (1)
- hypocrisy (1)
- igon value (1)
- iit (1)
- inflation (1)
- information asymmetry (1)
- iphone (1)
- jack kerouac (1)
- jaynes (1)
- jazz (1)
- jfk (1)
- john dolan (1)
- john kerry (1)
- john paulson (1)
- john searle (1)
- john tierney (1)
- jonathan littell (1)
- las vegas (1)
- lawyers (1)
- lehman auction (1)
- les bienveillantes (1)
- lowell wood (1)
- lse (1)
- machine (1)
- mcgeorge bundy (1)
- mexico (1)
- michael jackson (1)
- mickey rourke (1)
- migration (1)
- money:tech (1)
- myron scholes (1)
- netwon institute (1)
- networks (1)
- newton institute (1)
- nfl (1)
- oliver stone (1)
- phil gramm (1)
- philanthropy (1)
- philip greenspun (1)
- portfolio theory (1)
- power laws (1)
- pyschology (1)
- randomness (1)
- recession (1)
- sales (1)
- skype (1)
- standard deviation (1)
- starship troopers (1)
- students today (1)
- teleportation (1)
- tierney lab blog (1)
- tomonaga (1)
- tyler cowen (1)
- venice (1)
- violence (1)
- virtual meetings (1)
- wealth effect (1)
2 comments:
They say that times like this are were some make there mint. Of course they said that a few months ago as well :)
Have fun SciFoo-ing.
My old grandfather left me a couple of words of wisdom in order to get rich. He said that there would be 4 opportunities in your life to sell 30 year T-Bonds at 120and you would get the same crack at buying them at 65-68. He also mentioned the ubiquitous Chicago/Minneapolis wheat spread, that inverts every 20 years or so. Another slam dunk trade. He mentioned the gold/platinum spread that inverts every 25 years or so, and to put it on when inverted. So far I've heeded his advice. By the way, he was 100 years old when he gave me this info.
Post a Comment