tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post2146984490164600476..comments2024-01-13T18:57:18.243-05:00Comments on Information Processing: Data Mining the UniversitySteve Hsuhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02428333897272913660noreply@blogger.comBlogger24125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-10366537499564787532010-04-21T16:06:39.437-04:002010-04-21T16:06:39.437-04:00you claim that SATs fluctuate very little.How do y...you claim that SATs fluctuate very little.How do you expain the fact that I raised my SAT score from 1990/2400 to 2120/2400? my math score soared from a 620 to a 740.my Critical reading score was constant at 690Datinghttp://www.luvfree.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-62412614522887217342010-04-06T00:21:55.900-04:002010-04-06T00:21:55.900-04:00The math boost may have also come from hybrid vigo...The math boost may have also come from hybrid vigour.catpersonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-49372221983264641162010-04-06T00:16:59.826-04:002010-04-06T00:16:59.826-04:00Yes I've noticed the same thing. There are ve...Yes I've noticed the same thing. There are very few white women in high-tech, and the few caucasoid women tend to be non-white caucasoids (East Indians & Jews). I'm pretty sure males of all races have a slightly higher mean and larger SD than their female counterparts but it hards to quantify in exact terms because it's different on different tests.catpersonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-56401322220270814302010-04-05T23:53:30.801-04:002010-04-05T23:53:30.801-04:00I work in the software industry. Women tend to be ...I work in the software industry. Women tend to be under represented in the high-tech end of this (which is the only part of it that I am familiar with).<br /><br />However, the patterns are interesting.<br /><br />The largest group of females in the high-tech software industry is Chinese females. The next largest group is Indian females. Then Caucasian females, but they tend to be Jews.<br /><br Some Guynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-25190995833194549602010-04-05T23:47:10.668-04:002010-04-05T23:47:10.668-04:00My oldest daughter increased her SAT score by 130 ...My oldest daughter increased her SAT score by 130 points on the older 1600 point SAT test. My youngest daughter got 800 on more than one of the SAT II math tests ... <br /><br />Both are half Chinese ... Their verbal skills and some of their math skills come from their father, the math boost comes from their mother who has a very male 2D/4D ratioSome Guynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-36536961369196722592010-04-05T16:20:51.820-04:002010-04-05T16:20:51.820-04:00We blinded ourselves to gender and race until the ...We blinded ourselves to gender and race until the very end. As we were completing the paper we thought we should have a look just in case something startling was going on. Re: race there isn't anything that surprising to the cognoscenti.<br /><br />The university is OK with this as long as there is no personally identifying information in the results.steve hsuhttp://duende.uoregon.edu/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-37920761034712929812010-04-05T15:42:18.100-04:002010-04-05T15:42:18.100-04:00I am too far away from academics to offer sensible...I am too far away from academics to offer sensible advice, except that you would want to make your (nice) graphics even prettier for Science/Nature. They love them pretty pictures!<br /><br />By the way, did the university offer any pushback on this work? That is, aren't there regulations about how professors can use the data that they can access in this way?<br /><br />Related, did you Dave Kanenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-37683966715642641282010-04-05T14:19:40.995-04:002010-04-05T14:19:40.995-04:00Any suggestions? One well-known psychometrician th...Any suggestions? One well-known psychometrician thought we might be able to get the threshold result into Science or Nature!steve hsuhttp://duende.uoregon.edu/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-88446843254440606862010-04-05T13:50:35.343-04:002010-04-05T13:50:35.343-04:00Where do you plan to submit this for publication?Where do you plan to submit this for publication?Dave Kanenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-83773495936883559322010-04-05T11:22:40.360-04:002010-04-05T11:22:40.360-04:003. Underachievers exist in all majors, with high S...<i>3. Underachievers exist in all majors, with high SAT scores but<br />very low GPAs. These underachievers are disproportionately male.</i><br /><br />I deal with one of these guys everyday. Slowly but surely I will get him to be as hardworking and achievement oriented as he is capable of.Davidnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-37117719941233466472010-04-05T02:08:16.407-04:002010-04-05T02:08:16.407-04:00Re: Female overachievers
Another explanation could...Re: Female overachievers<br />Another explanation could be that many females underperform during high-pressure competitive tests like SAT, so they ARE actually smarter than their SAT scores show.<br />See for example "Gender Gap in Admission Performance Under Competitive Pressure": http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1483802Jirka Lahvickanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-6376955202404570912010-04-05T00:21:04.722-04:002010-04-05T00:21:04.722-04:00You can see exactly how rare a 120 point gain on S...You can see exactly how rare a 120 point gain on SAT-M was in our data by looking at figure 1. It happens, but it's rare.<br /><br />Tools like SAT can only be used *statistically* -- i.e., applied to large groups of people. For a large group of people who take the test twice the average gain would be roughly 20-40 points.steve hsuhttp://duende.uoregon.edu/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-53643071486745816492010-04-05T00:07:44.403-04:002010-04-05T00:07:44.403-04:00In your paper,you claim that SATs fluctuate very l...In your paper,you claim that SATs fluctuate very little.How do you expain the fact that I raised my SAT score from 1990/2400 to 2120/2400.my math score soared from a 620 to a 740.my Critical reading score was constant at 690.kimnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-70870189424100926802010-04-04T19:43:21.328-04:002010-04-04T19:43:21.328-04:00Steve, in none of your posts do you address a crit...Steve, in none of your posts do you address a critical hypothesis: could it be that, above a certain moderate threshold, increases in IQ have no influence on one's likelihood of getting laid? This is the true issue at hand.Jose Farrentesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-41939952283005718402010-04-04T15:50:01.320-04:002010-04-04T15:50:01.320-04:00The simplest reasonable model for college performa...The simplest reasonable model for college performance has *two* input factors: ability and conscientiousness. Your claim of SAT bias would require that we know that the conscientiousness distribution is the same for men and women. I suspect it is not... (Women who are having trouble with physics 101 are more likely to come to office hours than men.)steve hsuhttp://duende.uoregon.edu/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-11713309871644489052010-04-04T15:43:03.299-04:002010-04-04T15:43:03.299-04:00From a psychometric perspective, the existence of ...From a psychometric perspective, the existence of a disproportionate number of female overachievers implies that the math SAT is biased against women. When a test systematically underpredicts the achievement of an entire group, that is the technical defenition of bias in the psychometric literature, or at least one of the major criteria for concluding that a test is biased. Other criteria catpersonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-29152849817254765052010-04-04T15:37:07.790-04:002010-04-04T15:37:07.790-04:00Another interesting point your data may shed light...Another interesting point your data may shed light on is whether the (math) SAT predicts higher GPA for the entire range of SAT scores or whether there is a point beyond which the SAT is not predictive. It has been argued (though I personally am a little skeptical of this argument) that the SAT is a good measure of g up to about IQ 135 but beyond IQ 135, the SAT is not discriminating very well catpersonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-70785487167043374292010-04-04T15:21:19.099-04:002010-04-04T15:21:19.099-04:00I think I see what you're saying. 2 variables...I think I see what you're saying. 2 variables could have a linear relationship in theory, but in practice there are limitations to the full expression of this relationship. In any event, linear was probably not the best word. What I really object to is the notion of thresholds mostly because they're so vaguely defined, there are always freak exceptions (i.e. a NBA player who is only 5&catpersonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-90223731258148270142010-04-04T14:53:32.758-04:002010-04-04T14:53:32.758-04:00Catperson,
I'm not sure the existence of a th...Catperson,<br /><br />I'm not sure the existence of a threshold (as we define it) implies the nonlinearity in learning rate with g that you don't like. If the work factor for learning physics or pure math increases linearly with lower g, eventually mastery may require more than, e.g., 60 hours per week for the standard course load. Students in this situation, even the most dedicated, steve hsuhttp://duende.uoregon.edu/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-60830902089855014442010-04-04T14:17:58.330-04:002010-04-04T14:17:58.330-04:00On the subject of thresholds, Jensen once stated t...On the subject of thresholds, Jensen once stated that there were four thresholds from which IQ gets almost all of its significance. <br /><br />1. Can or can not attend a regular school (IQ 50)<br />2. Can or can not master the traditonal subject matter of elementary school (IQ 75)<br />3. Can or can not handle college prep courses (IQ 105)<br />4. Can or can not get university grades high catpersonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-53107061713958011552010-04-04T14:02:39.605-04:002010-04-04T14:02:39.605-04:00I don’t believe in thresholds. I believe that g (...I don’t believe in thresholds. I believe that g (or more specific aptitudes) has predictive validity in all domains and that the lower your g the less likely you are to succeed in anything (especially g loaded activities), but I believe such relationships tend to be linear for the full range of ability and achievements. I’m sure there are exceptions but I’ve never seen any convincing evidence catpersonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-20070091730480411082010-04-04T10:34:17.357-04:002010-04-04T10:34:17.357-04:00Dave,
I have not seen similar studies but they pr...Dave,<br /><br />I have not seen similar studies but they probably exist. Until recently such studies would have been big projects requiring significant cooperation from the administration. Now that so much data is web-accessible, a couple of enterprising professors with some programming skills can just grab it and analyze it in their spare time! The biggest data sets I've seen analyzed are steve hsuhttp://duende.uoregon.edu/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-44100325611070943142010-04-04T10:19:06.708-04:002010-04-04T10:19:06.708-04:00This is great stuff -- both the results and the op...This is great stuff -- both the results and the open discussion and debate it generates. Are there similar studies for other schools?Dave Backusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5880610.post-4682585491821332422010-04-04T03:39:52.903-04:002010-04-04T03:39:52.903-04:00Theres a huge "wait man remember this" c...Theres a huge "wait man remember this" component.<br /><br />Chicks often enter bullshit GPA inflation studies such as liberal arts courses,where everyone is handed a 4.0 for kissing ass, trying to tell the teacher what the want to here, not being pissed off about it, and avoiding any math fields like the plague.<br /><br />Guys dont do that.<br /><br />That probably explains half of kakarotnoreply@blogger.com